7th heaven / Illinois Entertainer interview - June, 2004
(Excerpts of this appear in the June 2004 Issue)
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*What strategy/approach worked the best for you when you were starting as a band trying to build an initial fan base?
Richie/7th heaven: We realized early off that we needed money to be able to accomplish everything we wanted to accomplish.
We realized that in order to make money, we couldn't simply play our 45 minute set of originals.
We would play a show like that for $300 bucks and that would have to cover all of our expenses.
Money was coming out of our own pockets to support the band and it was becoming more and more difficult to have fun.
So the strategy we put into place was we decided to become an original band that played covers. We started playing in bars
with natural draws, built an fan base (a mailing list), and worked our way up the ladder. We usually play 45 minutes of originals
during a show mixed in with covers to make the money at the bars. It's a win/win. By doing this, we paid for our own
Pro-Tools studio, a van, computers, office equipment, all of our marketing materials, video equipment, a double CD of 30 songs
and so on. The bars get a happy crowd because we play the covers they want to hear and hopefully they walk away liking
our original songs as well. So far this has happened and we feel fortunate.
Not all bands are willing to do this for whatever reason - but it works for us.
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*What's your main philosophy on touring? (big venues, as often as you can, etc.)
Richie/7th heaven: Play as often as you can in different markets. When we break into a new market, we try to get on a bill
with a band that draws well and play to their crowd. How do we get those gigs? We use the money we make at other shows
to make promotional CDs, posters, flyers, and we give these to our street team in these different markets to help promote.
Clubs recognize our efforts, know that we are willing to make an investment in their town, and in kind put us on good nights
and good time slots to get exposure. As time passes, hopefully we have our own following.
Ultimately, it boils down to money and a willingness to make a commitment in a town. We also try to play (and have played)
different types of venues successfully. We play festivals, sports bars, clubs, concert halls and colleges all
not only to play to different people but different types of people.
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*What's the 1 key piece of advice/direction you would give a new band to gain a following and start selling records?
Richie/7th heaven: Play everywhere and anywhere you can, the 3 points to any bands success is:
1 - Gain new fans, 2 - Sell product, 3 - Make money
Those rules apply to everyone from a garage band to madonna
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*What's the most common mistake you've seen new bands making in regards to touring/marketing/selling records?
Richie/7th heaven: Any band who sets out from the start to get a record deal and sits around and waits for one is making a mistake.
We try every single day to make our own breaks - not with the hope that some record company exec will notice -
but so we can build our own business. We feel if we are aggressive and follow our business plan, we will be successful.
If we have success and someone wants to help us along the way, great. If not, we are still moving forward,
building an infrastructure and having fun.
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*What do you like most about being unsigned?
Richie/7th heaven: We are our own marketing department, distributor (locally), creative department, webmaster, CD duplicator,
producer, video maker, manager and booking agent. We are in control and always know where our money is.
We put out a 30 song CD that we probably wouldn't have been able to if we were signed. We know that as long as we work hard,
we can sustain and even thrive. Our record company (us) will never go under, it's parent company will never decide it wants
out of the music business, and we will never have to look out for anyone but ourselves.
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*Unsigned bands seem better off now than 10 years ago. Why is that? Is it that labels are in trouble?
That recording is cheaper? That there are more cheaper marketing options with the Internet?
Richie/7th heaven: We can do a lot of the things a record label can do. So can other unsigned bands.
We can write, record, produce, and master our own albums. We can duplicate our own CDs. We can create our own website
and other marketing materials. We can create our own music videos. We can maintain our own fan club.
We can book our own shows. We can handle the business side of the band without any mysterious "new medium" charges
or funky contracts. We are our own radio promoters. We are our own publishing company. We are our own merchandising company.
We think that record labels are especially good at distribution. They also bring a level of credibility and they have more contacts
to get stuff done. But we sometimes question is it worth losing control of our band for that. I mean - if we sell 20,000 albums -
we will make a good deal of money (so far we've moved over 5,000). If we're signed and sell 20,000 albums -
we make no money and we're considered a failure. Are record labels in trouble? Ya - they have a poor business structure in place,
the cost of a CD in stores is way too high, and they spend too much money on keeping Mariah and Whitney (for example)
on the label based off of PAST success and newer artists suffer due to lack of funds for creative development and marketing.
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*Do you make a profit or just enough to get buy?
Richie/7th heaven: We make a profit. More recently, we have made less of a profit because we have been spending a great deal
of money on promoting the band to take us to higher levels in different markets. If we didn't do this and just played in the
Chicagoland area, we could all live comfortably off the band. But right now, we are looking to get into many college markets
across the US and in markets where our CD is getting spun.
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*Do you and your band members have other side jobs, or is this your only source of income?
Richie/7th heaven: We all do other things to supplement our income. We're all hard working and do whatever we can when
we're not playing or practicing. The great thing is, none of that money ever has to pay for band expenses because the band
is self sufficient. We are also lucky to have a dedicated crew to help us load in and load out as well as sell merchandise.
Without them, we definitely could not do all we do.
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*Have you weighed the options of if you would make more money as a small band on a major label or releasing music on your own?
Richie/7th heaven: If those are our only choices - we would choose to do it on our own. We know of a lot of small bands on
major record labels who make less money than we do. And if they get dropped - the whole infrastructure is gone.
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*What are your key money makers?
Richie/7th heaven: Shows make us the most money followed by CD sales followed by merchandise sales.
We've been told we lose credibility by playing covers - but what we may lose in credibility we gain in new fans
(because we play in front of a lot of people) and that translates to money.
At the end of the day - if we move 20,000 CDs that's pretty credible.
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*What's the most creative thing your band has done to make money?
Richie/7th heaven: We treat our band like a business - and in that regard we think we're somewhat unique.
We try not to be too gimmicky - we just try to keep our show fresh and fun and do our best to make it a great night for our fans
and the venue owner or promoter. Our marketing budget is a significant percentage of our total budget and
we utilize everything we do to its fullest.
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*Can bands of your size recoup of the costs of making a DVD?
Richie/7th heaven: We can, because we own a lot of our own video equipment. We are working on a new video right now,
and are capturing a lot of our live shows digitally. Why would we create our own videos? Mainly because a lot of booking agents
want to see our live show before they book us. We've gotten a lot of shows simply because our press pack has basic video footage
of our live shows. Our relationship with MTV was a result of an older DVD we created, because it added credibility.
We're now taking it to the next level creatively. Will our fans buy the DVD? We think so.
Regardless - booking agents will see the DVD and it can only help.